The Restaurant Technology Guys Podcast brought to you by Custom Business Solutions
The Restaurant Technology Guys Podcast brought to you by Custom Business Solutions
Navigating Restaurant Tech and Trends with Alicia Kelso
In this episode of the Restaurant Technology Guys podcast, host Jeremy Julian is joined by Alicia Kelso, Executive Editor for Nations Restaurant News. They discuss a wide array of topics, including Alicia's extensive background in restaurant journalism, the current and future trends in the restaurant industry, and the impacts of automation and technology on restaurant operations. They also touch on the importance of providing value and a holistic experience to consumers, the challenges and strategies of labor management, and the benefits of loyalty programs. The conversation delves into macroeconomic challenges, such as inflation and labor shortages, and practical advice on how restaurant operators can adapt to a rapidly evolving landscape.
00:00 Audio of Alicia NRN
01:06 Introduction and Guest Introduction
01:41 Alicia Kelso's Background and Career
02:46 The Draw of the Restaurant Industry
05:33 Current Trends and Challenges in the Restaurant Industry
11:54 The Importance of Value and Experience
20:15 Role of Technology in the Restaurant Industry
30:31 Future Outlook and Conclusion
This is the Restaurant Technology Guys podcast. Helping you run your restaurant better.
Jeremy Julian:In today's episode, we are joined by Alicia Kelso. Alicia has been covering the space since I think she said 2008 or 2009. She is one of those really prolific writers writes from the nation's restaurant news, which is the industry's largest publication. Her. And I go through a wide variety of topics, including where guests are spending more time, how to restaurants continue to compete in such a weird market space. The surprises that happen in 2020 for the things that we expect to see happen in 2025 and beyond. As well as just how automation and technology continues to impact the ways that restaurants operate each and every day. If you don't know me, my name is Jeremy Julian. I am the chief revenue officer for custom business solutions. We sell the north star on a cell solution for multiunit restaurants. Check us out at CBSnorthstar.com and now on to our episode Welcome back to the restaurant technology guys podcast I thank everyone out there for joining us as I say each and every time I know you guys got lots of choices So Thanks for hanging out on the air with us today. I am joined by a very special guest I'm gonna leave I let Alicia talk about herself here for a second But I was sharing with her prior to hitting the record button I've been reading some of the stuff that she's written for a long time pretty much since she's been in the space So Alicia, why don't you introduce ourselves? I am certain everybody on that's listening here has seen something you've written But whether they've seen the face and know exactly who you are Why don't you introduce yourself and give us a little bit of background about? About where you came from
Alicia Kelso:Thank you, Jeremy. Journalism 101, don't talk about yourself, so I'm a little uncomfortable doing but, I appreciate you having me. My name is Alicia Kelso. I'm the Executive Editor for Nations Restaurant News. we are the largest trade publication covering this one trillion dollar industry now, which is thrilling to say because I actually started covering this industry In the throes of the Great Recession 2009. for fast casual.com QSR Web and Pizza Marketplace. in 2018, I jumped over to the consumer side covering the industry for Forbes. I also contributed to Restaurant Dive and I joined Nations Restaurant News in October. Of 2022 and have been there ever since as their executive editor. love this industry so much. My father was an independent restaurant owner. He, I had a steakhouse in Finley, Ohio called George's. and so it's very near and dear to my heart. And I left for two or three years when my kid was born to go into higher ed. And I realized how much I regretted that and boomeranged right back in with, with intensity. So glad to be back here. Yeah,
Jeremy Julian:I've said it a few times I think there's probably some therapy for restaurant people that try and get out and come back because It's one of those things that does end up sucking you back in and I guess I'd love a little bit of opinion Why do you think that is? Why do you think it's such a it's such a draw because we I see it all The time I see people that once you've gotten in and you've gotten the bug it doesn't end up leaving and people end up inevitably coming back
Alicia Kelso:and that's a really great point because whenever I share my personal story, upon introduction or otherwise, there's a lot of people who have very similar stories about boomeranging back in or trying something new. And, for, I can't answer for them, but for me personally, I can tell you that It's definitely the people, nothing against higher ed, I, the restaurant industry is energetic. It's exciting. it's a hospitality industry, service industry, people first industry, and it just has that sort of thrilling nature, to it where there's always something exciting happening and we all use it and we all, it's exciting to talk about my job because, people really. they can relate, it's so relative, to, to them and their daily lives. and I think there's just, it's just so deep in who we are as a society. we talked about having a 1 trillion industry. There's a reason for that. and so I think it's also interesting, Jeremy, because it's certainly not for the faint of heart. Yeah.
Jeremy Julian:at the end of the day that, it's democratized. The thing I love about the restaurant industry is everybody gets in and a lot of people are really successful. We've got, presidents of brands that started as a dishwasher years ago that have worked their way up. And it's one of the only industries that you can do that in, in today's day and
Alicia Kelso:Yeah. And I also love that almost, so many, I think it's like one in six or seven Americans have been employed by a restaurant industry. we have higher levels of diversity within our workforce. it is just such a, culturally, diverse, Landscape from the workforce, perspective. So I think that is really exciting, too. and it's a good place for people to go when perhaps there's really nothing else. it's a great starter job and a great like you said, we've done a really good job in this industry. Especially through the past five years, really focusing on how this can be a career and not just a, a starter job in high school. And I've said, we're seeing more stories from our vantage point of that coming to fruition, which is really exciting.
Jeremy Julian:I love that. And, I say it all the time. I think the world would be a better place if everybody worked in a restaurant for at least six months of their life, because all of my kids are going to have to work in the service industry in some way and deal with the public because, I'm certain it'll make it, make it better from a macro perspective. Alicia, you and I talked a little bit pre show, talk to me about what it is that you guys are saying, seeing in the restaurant industry, because it's been, there's been so many stories out there. Obviously, there's some big headwinds in certain markets and then there's some others that have been, doing, that have got tailwinds. Talk to me from a macro level, what are you guys seeing at Nations Restaurant News, just of the industry as a whole? Because I think it'll really format the rest of our conversation for the next 20 minutes or so, about where can people impact them, their own business as they look back at themselves and say, hey, how do I make some changes there?
Alicia Kelso:Yeah, that's a really interesting question, because I think, if we zoom out quick, 2024 was much bumpier than anyone expected going into it. I think, 23, we had a little bit of a hangover. late 23, we had a little bit of a hangover from what we saw as a real strong, Resurgence or renaissance, if you will, in late 22 into early 23, based on pent up demand from the pandemic, based on recovery from what was a historically low, Employment pool, we had to close our stores, our restaurants, and trim hours and days in much of 2021, because we just didn't have an employee base, to keep them operational. and so all of these things, this confluence of issues that were created by the pandemic and extended started to dissipate. A little bit in late 20, in late 22, in early 23, that was this insane sales year and traffic and entertainment everywhere. And it was just this true Renaissance. and so going into 24, I remember late 23, there was a significant amount of optimism and that just all went out the window. And I think what the biggest issue from my vantage point, Jeremy, was because we were dealing with historically high inflation rates, generationally high, if you will, we had to price, we had to take a lot of price in this industry across segments, across brands, and I would argue we probably overpriced. And so now, abruptly in this year, early this year, probably late Q1, early Q2, traffic fell off a cliff. And normally we start to see some decent results in Q2 and sustain through the summer, and that just never came to fruition. So everybody, who's an operator or proximate to an operator is aware of this, right? So what are we dealing with now, per your question? Recovery from that. I would argue that we, Probably needed to do and still have the opportunity to do a better job of communicating to our customers why prices are a little bit higher. and a lot higher in some instances, we probably could do a better job menu engineering. To get through some of those, food pressures that are weighing on the cost of sales. But we also have to recognize that the P and L is never going to look like it did in 2019. and that's, I think we're all wanting it to get back to 2019. It's not just food costs that aren't going back to now things going back to 2019. I think as long as we adjust our mindset and our, Our operations, our business model to understand that the PNL is going to be different and understand what that new normal means and work our way through that the middle of the PNL a little bit better, become more efficient, perhaps understand how tech is Can help us in some circumstances, but not go overboard on tech just because there's a shiny bell and whistle in front of us, understand that, energy efficiency can be a really viable, saving, tactic in the middle of that P and L things like that. I think are just becoming smarter, more sophisticated operators, again, 2019.
Jeremy Julian:Yeah. No, I love all of those and I'm going to, I'm going to dig in a little bit to some of those Alicia. one of the other things that you alluded to is labor is hard to come by. It's still hard to come by in, in 2024 and even if you do get labor, keeping them around is hard. Keeping them employed and employment costs have gone up. Significantly as well. through that last five year period. it's funny that you say, everybody came out of that Renaissance and I think there was a lot of people that are like, Oh, it's good. It's going to continue going into 2024. But with the interest rates, I think the other thing I'm hearing from restaurant brands is they're not able to expand as quickly into new venues because the cost of money to borrow money to open up new venues, as well as the construction costs and the labor costs to open those things. In some instances has almost doubled to open new brands. Is that something you're hearing across the
Alicia Kelso:It is. And I think that's where the challenge is. It's again, we're not just contending with double digit higher food costs. It's everything. It's energy costs are higher rent. Occupancy costs are what 12 to 15 percent higher. it's across the board. And to your point, to borrow money is more expensive. I know that interest rates, we've had two or three reductions recently that they're still high, right?
Jeremy Julian:they're still high historically from where people were in 2019 where it was almost free to borrow money to
Alicia Kelso:I, and again, we're, we got to stop comparing. Oh, 2019 was, it was a good thing for anyone who wanted the capital, to borrow, to grow their business. What. I think it is, again, what I'm seeing with all of that confluence of issues happening, including, like you said, higher, cost of money, cost of borrowing is instead of aggressive unit growth, is focusing on four wall, four wall profitability, reigning in sort of the ambitious, growth, expansion plans that we might have signing huge deals out of the gate, with a franchise group here or there and really getting our unit economics in check and taking a slower approach to growth while we figure out how to work our way through these, massively different material, a different, P and L situations that we have an understanding, this is still very new. So we have to understand what new normal is. and while we're, instead of waiting to go back to 2019, understanding what new normal is and how do we modernize our business model to keep pace with that new normal versus comparing it to 2019, if that makes sense.
Jeremy Julian:Absolutely. I want to dig into tech in just a second, but you said something that, that intrigued me. You talked about educating our consumers as to why pricing has increased. I, long time listeners know I'm a family of six. I have four children. life is, going out to eat is a It's expensive regardless of where I'm going, and I'm not looking to point any fingers at any brand names, but at the end of the day, it's expensive. And whether you go on full service or you're going quick serve or you're going fast casual, unfortunately, even in my wallet share, those things, oftentimes for a family of six, they're very close, outside of a gratuity potentially. I can oftentimes go out to a value menu at a casual dining brand. I can go out to a fast casual brand. And the bottom line dollars are very similar sometimes even in a quick serve brand, if I'm not, if I'm doing it in certain ways. And so across the board, how would you recommend, or how have you seen people be successful at even educating their consumers? Cause some people have figured it out. Some brands, whether it's, Wingstop or. I don't say they're killing it, but they're doing really well from a stock perspective, from a sales growth perspective, and their prices have increased oftentimes in those same percentages as some of the other brands. We talked to, I talked with another editor of a magazine recently, we talked about Chili's. Chili's is doing really well. And historically Chili's hasn't been one of those brands that's played in that space. And so I'd love to know, how do you recommend restaurant tours, whether you're an individual operator or you're a large chain, how do you Help your consumers understand what has happened macroeconomically to the business to, to, so that they understand that it's not just that it's all going into somebody's greedy pockets, but it's a cost of doing business. Cause I think unfortunately people go, ah, they're just, they're raising the prices because they're looking to make more money.
Alicia Kelso:and that, I think that depends on your concept. I really, I think that, one thing we saw this year that, that sort of blew my mind along the lines of the question you're asking is when the Wendy's CEO talked about surge pricing, versus dynamic pricing and dynamic you, you and I both know dynamic pricing has been around for forever. we take a page from the airlines, we take a page from hotels, we take a page from Uber, and Lyft and so on and so forth. And happy hour has been around for forever. So surge pricing or dynamic pricing is a great example here of what the messaging needs to be, to customers. And it goes back to pushing through the message of what the value is. And it's not just price, Jeremy. It's what, this is why Chipotle has done so well. This is why Texas Roadhouse has done so well because they are messaging their value proposition and it's not hinging on a price. with Texas Roadhouse, you get the rolls, you get the two sides, it's abundance, with Chipotle, it's convenience, it's a customization, it's a, the digital. to the brand that, that the brand has really worked in earnest to, to really improve. and their portions, they invested in their getting their portions back, chips and guac, that kind of stuff. I think where we are starting to get a little better. And I would argue this year was a wake up call with all of this. And I started to see this. in Q3, the more earnings calls I sat on with public brands and a lot of executives just fully admitted, Hey, we have to make some adjustments. We are seeing consumer behaviors linger in a way where they don't want us just to push limited time offers or 25 cent, 50 cent mozzarella sticks. They want full meal deals. they want a comprehensive, a holistic approach to value. Again, that's where Chili's I think has found it's, footing. That's why Applebee's adjusted over to what sort of what Chili's is doing. And so I think if we continue to double down on that message of here's why this is valuable, I think we'll make a lot of progress from where we've been, especially, this year, but we have to make it really clear, that this is, This is a huge value proposition. I don't think we need to get into the nitty gritty. Hey, food costs are higher. customers don't care. Yeah, they know. And they don't care. They just want what's quick, easy and affordable for them. And affordable right now, is way different than it was when I started covering the industry in 20, in 2009. Back then it was a price game, but now it's, Oh gosh, I'm getting two sides and, And, and rolls and peanuts. And, these servers are these servers are great to me. They're really attentive and, they're quick and efficient. that is a huge value proposition now. And I think the holistic thing is where we need to really focus on. Yeah,
Jeremy Julian:and I think the other piece that I would say and you guys recently wrote about it. the Cracker Barrel group, large brand there. they were struggling for years and they're now, you know back out Not only innovating, but also sharing, but the one thing I'd love for you to hit on before we jump to technology is it's gotta be an experience, whatever that experience is. We are hospitality. It has to be an experience. So when you talk about roadhouse, when you go into a Texas roadhouse, there's energy, there's a vibe. There's an attitude. When you drive through the drive through at Chick fil A, you get an experience. When you go to. I was recently at Portillo's and, that brand it's, there's an energy, there's a vibe when you walk into the brand, a brand out of the West coast, I just had breakfast at yesterday morning, Huckleberry's, and the, it's, it, you feel it when you walk in and you feel it the opposite way. And I'm not going to name any brands, but you can feel it the opposite way when it's not there, when they're not, when they're not trained, when they're not hospitable, when they're not, when they, what do you want, kind of attitude, you realize that's not necessarily the thing that, that you need. I just had Uber, Uber direct on, on my phone. On the latest podcast that we released, they talked about the fact that even the drivers are guests of your restaurant. You have to treat them as such because they may be patrons in the future. And have you seen that be something that, that you hear CEOs talking about being part of what they're doing, they're creating an experience for value, but they also have to make sure that their staff and their buildings and their food is all, part of that equation.
Alicia Kelso:And I think what's really interesting is we talked about the issues we are working our way through that were born from the pandemic. And I think what happened now that we've got almost five years of hindsight, which is even weird to say out loud, the pendulum swung in a weird way. It just upended so much about our day to day. And what that meant in the industry is it meant supply chain issues, labor issues, food costs, in skyrocketing inflate inflation, labor becoming, So necessary, they were, our employees were deemed essential workers. So how are we going to keep them? So the pendulum just really swung. And I think what happened is because we had to go off premises by mandate, and just for comfort level, when people felt unsafe to be in, to be outside and out and about, we became a little too transactional. And that is what I'm hearing now in droves. We're seeing it with, Starbuck's new CEO, Brian Nichol has said it. Hey, this is one of the major places we screwed up. We became too trans, too transactional. We need to be digital, but we also are trying, there's a lot of concepts out there and a lot of executives out there really, pushing this message that the, we are the hospitality to industry to your point, and we did become too transactional. To survive in those, really awful, times. But now we've got to get back to that hospitality piece that people piece that, community piece. I'm hearing this all over the board, whether it is from a Texas roadhouse, to, to Starbucks, wanting to get back there. Subway just launched a new design prototype that they're talking about how it's. Improving Dine In. That's not something I think about with Subway, but even Subway is talking about this. Dutch Bros, Kava is really big on this hospitality piece, whether it's a digital customer or a Dine In customer. So I think we're going to see a pendulum swing back and hopefully settle a little bit more. I think the brands that win are the ones to your point, Jeremy, that can, Provide some sort of, personalization, hospitality, whether they, again, they are a digital or a dine in customer, but it is something that this industry is really starting to focus on a little bit more. Again, to your point, because we probably became too transact, we took too much pricing and we became too transactional.
Jeremy Julian:and that really goes into, how does technology play a part? Because I think all too often, and I think about it from, we were, because of the pandemic and just how fast everything accelerated, we threw a lot of solutions at problems without architecting them. And unfortunately, when we throw a lot of solutions at those problems, without architecting what the guest experience is going to be like from start to finish, whether that's digital on a kiosk, that's digital on your phone, that's through a drive through without it. And again, there's some brands that have done it really well, and there's other brands that have really struggled. But how does technology play a part in that, Alicia? Because I think all too often, and I say this to our listeners, A lot, depending upon how I'm interacting with a brand. There are times that I'm doing it just to satiate my family. I'm driving home from baseball practice and we need food. We need it quick. I don't want an experience. I want it right. I want it fast. I want it hot and I want it in the bag and I don't want to have to go back a second time. And then there's other times I want to have an experience and I want to sit down. How do we personalize that experience? How do we even know what the guests are looking for in that regard? And how does it become, Part of one of those things where you can train that staff without throwing because, again, more and more brands have 10, 12, 15 pieces of technology in the front of the house. And these staff members that have been there for six months or three weeks, they're having to learn it all and deal with it. And how do they do it? How do they do it effectively?
Alicia Kelso:I think that's a bigger conversation, but I would argue to your point, hot, quick, convenient, what you said is an experience, right? So accurate. that is part of the experience with you being that digital customer and satiating your family. and so I think where we're seeing this the most as we have this conversation ramping up about experience and hospitality and getting back to that, connection that the industry is known for and was built on. The biggest piece of that is loyalty programs. And that, I think has a number of, Tailwinds that it can produce. There were obviously nothing new. I had the little punch card at subway back and back in the day, but they've evolved so much to the point where they now know that you are coming in to satiate your family at a certain time of day. and what you're probably going to get for your, your four kids, all your kids after baseball practice or whatever. And we're seeing that, move at the speed of light right now. In fact, I'm. I was just going through third quarter transcripts and marveling at this, this whole conversation around we're personalizing, and all of it's happening through that loyalty program, as well as through AI systems, that can pull the data. And glean the data and separate the data, among consumer sets. And to your point as it pertains to personalizing from a technology standpoint, I think that is the biggest opportunity is under the ability to understand who your customers are, what they want, when they want it, and then leveraging that data. A step further with a loyalty program. I will go one step further here and say that technology is also playing a big role in making employees lives significantly easier and happy employees are happy customers. And thank God we finally figured that out in this industry. And I think it took us a global pandemic again, when our workers became essential employees and they were forced to go to work in a really scary, unknown, uncertain time. restaurant companies. large, big and small stepped up and said, How can we make this better for them? And we have really refined that to the point where labor scheduling it is easier. Kitchen display systems are now a critical adoption at critical mass right now, because all of it makes, they're, Reshuffling the back of house so that they can take less steps and it's less cluttered and it's more efficient. I talked to the Brinker CEO. He changed the pickles because the jar was too hard to open. And he said when they opened it, it splashed on them. Why would he do that quote to his employees? And so little things. Like that to make employees lives easier. And tech plays a huge role in that. and so I think it's a boulder moving up a hill. but I think that we are making some significant progress in understanding that if we make our employees lives easier, they're gonna stick around perhaps a little bit longer, and then they're gonna make our customers happier. And I think that the really quickly growing coffee shops like Dutch Bros are doing a really great job at this
Jeremy Julian:And now a word from one of our sponsors. Every restaurant operator understands the chaos of a Restaurant kitchen during the meal rush restaurant technologies, oil, total oil management solutions, and end to end automated oil management system that delivers filters, monitors, and recycles your cooking oil, taking the dirtiest jobs out of your kitchen and letting your employees focus on more important tasks. Control the kitchen chaos with restaurant technologies and make your kitchen safer. No upfront costs to learn more, check out rti inc. com or call 888 796 4997. Yeah, it's ironic because I, again, recently I had an interview with somebody that's doing some automation for the coffee industry and he was talking about, he's got a startup that is trying to help with the non coffee type beverages. He gave me a statistic that said at Starbucks, 10 years ago, only 20 or 10 percent or 12 percent of beverages were cold now over 75 are and 75 percent of them are modified So whereas you used to go in for a pike place drip coffee, 10 years ago now No longer does the pike place drip coffee become the majority almost every order is modified and they've got to do math And they've got to do these things. So technology is an enhancer. You talked about the kitchen I was on with the COO of Bobby's burgers and they're getting a double sided grill to cook their burgers faster and more efficiently. I know Chili's did something similar at Brinker to try and help with those things. What types of things do you think, I guess as leaders in our business, how do you pick the right thing to go do that? Because there's so many charlatans, there's so many people in our industry. I happen to be in the tech side of things. I have a podcast about it. So what I do professionally. And at the same time, I do this podcast because I want to see restaurants succeed, and I know that tech implemented well can solve guest problems and staff problems. How do leaders figure out where the bottlenecks are to their guest experience as well as their staff
Alicia Kelso:Yeah, that's a great question. You'd probably be better suited to answer that than I would, but I will tell you this is not a, this is not an equal playing field, so you look at a company like Chipotle that has no debt and fairly deep pockets and they're in earnest automating. Much of their work in the kitchen, on the make line and so on and so forth. So that is something that works best for Chipotle. For smaller operators, I think it depends on the concept. I think it depends on the clientele. What's your percentage? What's your mix on off premises? things, of that nature. Do you need a loyalty program? I, and I think this is probably the best. Maybe one of the biggest challenges that small restaurant groups and independents have, right now is it's they know that there's a need for technology to become more efficient, but they're looking at a million different solutions and where to start. And it comes down to what is the priority, what is the biggest pain point and may, and not, and not throwing spaghetti against a wall, but just understanding what your biggest pain point is, whether it's a call, you need a cost savings, something along those lines, and then I just being patient with the process,
Jeremy Julian:it reminds me of a conversation I had with Chris Demery from, from Blaze Pizza recently. He was on the show, a couple of months ago, and he talked about the fact when he first got to the brand, they were treating both the in person Yes, and the digital guests exactly the same. And I know Chapulte had some of those problems early on where you can't serve both guests the same way. You've got to figure out different levels of kitchen automation and kitchen efficiency. And he ended up doing two make lines and ultimately he solves the digital guest differently than he solved the in person guests. And so you can focus on both the in person guests and His story for those that didn't listen he went back and listened to guest surveys he looked at what those feedback mechanisms were and said, okay How do I solve this and then you go do site visits and you go figure those things out? I know that the Brinker guy talked about the some similar things He was watching how hard it was to make the food and said Where are those sticking points, whether it's the pickles or their, chicken tenders, selfishly. I loved Brinker's old, tempura chicken tenders. They stopped because they were too hard to make and they couldn't make them consistently. And so because of that, when they were good, they were fantastic. And when they weren't good, I'm one of those people that ordered them when they weren't good, they were awful. And so they took them off the menu because they couldn't produce them consistently. But I love your idea that says, go look, go. Spend the time to invest and then pick one or two things and keep your eye on the ball for those one or two things To solve them rather than trying to solve all of them at the same
Alicia Kelso:and to your point, that's where the data comes back into the picture. And I think that's the most critical piece that we've got to figure out. We restaurant operators don't have time. They're too busy operating restaurants that are seven days a week. In most cases, breakfast to close, who knows. And so they don't time to mine this data, but that the answers are typically in that data. And if they're not in that data about your customers and what the pain points are with them, then in the restaurants, in the kitchen, talking to your employees, Extensively, you will find out the pain points really quickly. And those are going to be the two best areas on what should become your priorities in terms of tech investment.
Jeremy Julian:Love that and I would also say that they should read the magazine because you guys talk about lots of cool
Alicia Kelso:try to,
Jeremy Julian:And i'm saying it. I know it's a shameless plug, but at the end of the day, I oftentimes get ideas for what big brands are doing because you guys write about it day in and day out And so there's people that are out there that are making these investments And many times they're paying off. Obviously, there's sometimes it doesn't pay off But when it does you guys write about it and you guys talk about those successes. So I love
Alicia Kelso:I appreciate that.
Jeremy Julian:yeah last question alicia, where is it going? Is it going back to and I realize that's a really hard question to answer I've been doing this close to 30 years and I, if somebody would have told me where things were going to be in 19 and then again in 20, I would have been like, yeah. There's no way restaurants are all going to shut down. and you're not gonna be able to go into them, but across the board, where do you think things are going? Do again, I, I see a convergence of, price point within, I see these brands that are succeeding because they're creating a good value proposition. But where do you see, continued investment? Where do you see people, doing those things in 2025 and beyond? Yes.
Alicia Kelso:ball, I'd be on a beach right now with a drink in my hand. but I've had several of these conversations, within the past several weeks and I always appreciate, picking everybody's brains, because I think collectively we're all either on the same page or near the same page. And I think what I can tell you in terms of where it's going in the near term, I think 2025 will more stable than 24. Thank God. less bumpy, if you will. I think that investors will come off the sideline. a little bit more than, 24 was pretty much silent, for the most part, but I think that the investments will open up a little bit more because of that stabilization. I think value is going to continue to play out, and consumers are going to continue to be, a little bit, Discerning. I think that is absolutely going to continue because there's still a lot of uncertainties. right now. One thing that intrigues me about this industry from a macro perspective, is we're retrenching. We've seen a lot of bankruptcies. We've seen mass closures among brands that didn't file for bankruptcy. And I don't want that to be perceived as just negative because I don't that can be that means we're getting Our system is getting healthier. Our industry is getting healthier. it's much bigger. There are far more brands than there were 10 years ago, and that's always going to be ebb and flow. And I think that, to that earlier conversation we had is just becoming smarter on the P and L and just focusing on four, for a while. Profitability versus aggressive growth just for growth's sake. I think that will become a bigger conversation. One thing that does intrigue me that I think is really happening is the blurring of the lines. So we're seeing c stores gain share of, market share away from QSRs in many instances. To your point earlier or even prior to this call, The price point between casual and fast casual and QSR isn't as stark as it used to be. we sit, we're seeing Pizza Hut at a drive thru. We're seeing Chipotle push the gas on their drive thrus. There's just a blurring of the lines now, and I think that is going to continue where we just have a big blurred industry and I think it's going to be market to market on what is successful and what is not And I think that you could have the best Performing restaurant of all time that's going to work here, but not here because our you know Our demographics our markets are becoming more bifurcated than they've ever been And so I think you know Where does it go from here? I think it's all over the map.
Jeremy Julian:Yeah. and the thing I would say that, that I've heard you say is this, Consumers are going to be more discerning with where they spend their dollars. And if they don't find the value, they're not going to come back. If they don't have a good experience, they're not going to come back. I think the days of being able to screw up a meal because you're the only casual dining place in town, but it doesn't matter because that's the only place you can go on a Friday night for a date night. Those days are gone. People will end up, making choices with their wallets and ultimately if you don't fix your operations, which some of that's technology, some of that's training, some of that's staffing, all of the things that we talked about, I think consumers are so much more discerning. They're going to choose with their wallet and it's going to show in your P& L if you don't deal with
Alicia Kelso:A hundred percent, and it's, and they're not just more discerning, they're more sophisticated. So they know when something's a little off. They have way more choices than they used to, and they don't need you. So block, to your point, blocking and tackling, is, has to be priority number one.
Jeremy Julian:Love it. How do people stay in touch Alicia? How do they, get to the magazine? How do they get to the publications you guys have because I want everybody out there to read what you guys are writing
Alicia Kelso:yes, we're at NRN. com and if want to reach out to me directly, it's Alicia, A L I C I A dot Kelso, K E L S O at Informa, dot com. Of course, we're on all socials as well. I'm personally on LinkedIn, invite anybody to connect and, always happy to have, conversations. The more conversations we have, the better the ideas. the better ideas manifest and, moving this industry forward is our priority at Nations Restaurant News. We're a trade publication. We love it here. we want everybody to succeed.
Jeremy Julian:and again, that's I know we talked about it prior to hitting the record button That's really why the restaurant technology guys podcast exists is I've you know made a career and I've gotten it Do some really cool things in the restaurant industry. So selfishly, I want to see restaurants succeed. I want to see them make good choices. I want to see guests experience get increased through the use of technology. I want to see all of the things that you talked about. So thank you for taking time. Thank you for reaching out. I've been a fan of, of what it is that you guys have been doing for a long time. So thank you for being on to our listeners, guys. thank you guys for, for listening and make it a great day.
Thanks for listening to the Restaurant Technology Guys podcast. Visit www. RestaurantTechnologyGuys. com for tips, industry insights, and more to help you run your restaurant better.
